atcomsystems.ca/forum Forums Wiring - Telecom Carriers - Trunks & Services Cabling Telephones Systems Wiring I need some help on the basics

I have to admit, I am rather intimidated posting on this site. I am (dare I say it?) an electrical contractor. I have been browsing this site for a few days now trying to learn everything I can about the basics of voice. I stumbled onto this site while searching Google images for 66 & 110 block images, and BTW, this is a great site! I wish I had found it a long time ago. While I am blown away by the endless variety and depth of experience and knowledge represented by this forum, I can't help but notice a slight :rolleyes: distaste among some of you for those engaged in my particular trade. I have however, been encouraged by the supportive attitude afforded those who, like myself, lack what can only be termed, "the most basic of telecom skills". Networking from the MDF all the way out to the station outlets is not a problem for me. I have attended training through BICSI and continue to do so to improve my skill set. I have installed and certified both copper and fiber networks. I understand how to physically punchdown both 66 and 110 blocks and through much study of this forum, I think I have a basic understanding of the pros and cons of using each in voice applications (I hope I don't start another 66 vs 110 vs Bix debate ). The black hole for me revolves around bringing the CO lines from the Demarc into the premise wiring system. I have many questions, but to keep this post from turning into a novel, may I start with just a couple?

1. In commercial applications, does the provider (Sprint, Verizon, etc.) typically install the required primary protectors on the incoming lines? If so, where do they typically place them? If my understanding is correct, residential NID's (provided by the service provider) have primary protection built into them, but I have not seen protectors at the Demarc on the commercial systems that I have looked at.

2. What is the proper method for routing cables and cross-connect wiring to and from 66 & 110 blocks? On 66 blocks, I think the station or CO cables come up from the bottom and the x-connect wiring goes around the top. Is there a standard for which side of the block the various terminations are to be made such as station & CO on the left and x-connect on the right? how does this work on 110 blocks?

3. On 50-pair 66 blocks, can you land wires on the center posts and use a bridge clip on the same post?

1. Yes, they should provide protection. The NEC does let them forgo protection in hi-rises that meet standards. You'll find communication in section 800.

2. Cabling in from the bottom jumpers over the top with mushrooms and about two fingers of slack. I use a separate block for the CO's except in very small installs. I also use both sides of a split block for my station cables. I've never used 110 for voice.

3. Yes

4. We're only hard on smart a$$ sparkies that won't listen and don't respect communications.

Welcome to the board.

Welcome aboard, Mr. You will get all of the help you need here. We only fuss about sparkies who become arrogant, develop attitude or simply trash a job. It is perfectly acceptable to admit that you have a question and are seeking advice. You will get all of the answers you need and then some here.

Many of us, myself included, are licensed electrical contractors. We are happy to assist. Stick around and by the way, welcome to the forum.

Your approach is a welcome change to some of those we've "chased away". Something tells me that you're built a lot like we are...a talented individual that's hell-bent on helping others. And may I say that you write really well? That's always appreciated (as is a sense of humor). Speaking of which, I really like the "Mr. Sparky to YOU" handle.

I think you'll find that there aren't any stupid questions, and that most of us are uncommonly patient in explaining even the most obvious things in our trade.

I truly hope you'll stay a while. I've got less than 1000 posts, yet everybody here is practically like family to me.

A warm welcome from me too, Garry.

Welcome to the Board!

I (unfortunately) have used 110 blocks for Voice more then I'd like - but you do what the spec calls for.

If you have to use them - Use them like you'd use 66 blocks. Bring the cabling up from the bottom and run the xconnects over the top.

There is no "left & right" on a 110 block. The feed cable gets cut down on the block and the xconnects get cut down on the "chiclet" on top.

Go with what Bill says and you won't go wrong.

Feel free to ask away. We're here to help.

Sam

Wow!

Thanks for the kind responses everyone. I definitely plan to stick around because I have a lot to learn about voice. I still subcontract 90% of my voice/data work to companies dedicated to that type of work. I actually started getting involved in networking back in the mid 90's when I couldn't find a voice/data company that would do the quality of work that my customer's wanted. I was tired of being embarassed at the job meetings when I would repeat what my data guy told me to the engineer/RCDD and they would look at me like I was an idiot. I started going to BICSI classes so I would know when I was being fed a line of stuff form my sub before I repeated it to the RCDD that I was reporting to. Now I am as much or more interested in the voice/data industry as I am in the electrical trade that basically hasn't changed in 100 years. Sorry about the rambling, I'm just excited to be here where I can finally get a grasp on some of this stuff that has eluded me for years. Now, back on topic:

So there is no standard for which side of the 66 block you use for x-connect? I have typically used 50 pr blocks and punched down the station cables on the left and the x-connects on the right using bridging clips for easy testing. Bill, if I use all 50 positions for the station
cables do I punch them down on the outer posts and use the center posts for x-connect? If so, doesn't that mean that I will have to pull the x-connect for testing?

One more thing (sorry for the long post again). The reason why I am so interested in the details is because I have been asked to teach a semester of electrical apprenticship training in my area. It is an entire semester dedicated strictly to "Structured Cabling Systems". As I said previously, I can handle the networking side of things because I have experience there, but I want to include the voice side because I have also been shocked at some of the work that passes as professional around here. I want to teach these apprentices to install this stuff the way you guys/gals do it before they get the bad habits burned into their brains. I don't know how much will stick, but I would at least like to try to be part of the solution rather then perpetuating the current problem, so any information that you would like to pass on, I would be glad (and appreciative) to absorb. Thanks again for the welcome and all of the comments and advice.

Garry

Well depends on what you're doing. To the first question the way I do it is in on the left out on the right. When I install a system I lay the system cable on the left side of the blocks out with my jumper on the right and bridge clip, so there's my test point. If you're not talking many station cables and don't mind using more blocks with just CO feeds, same principle. Jumper (In) on the left and stations (out) on the right and bridge clip. To muliple the CO's just loop and bridge clip. For small jobs you can get a 6pr connecting block for your CO's you can also get an 12pr. So it really depends on what and how much you're wiring. You leave the two fingers of slack on both ends of the jumper for the very reason you stated, if you have to pull the jumper to test. Good size jobs I use both sides of the block so jumpers have to be pulled if needed to test, but I've never found that to be a drawback.

There are a couple folks on the board who teach sturcture cabling, maybe they can give you some tips.

I always use both sides of the block because with Inter-Tel systems I use 1 amphenol cable per card.
I do the same for station cables, 12 per block, and use the center pins for my cross connects.

The reason why I am so interested in the details is because I have been asked to teach a semester of electrical apprenticship training in my area.

You might want to talk to Sam about that. It's what he does.

-Hal