and now, the end of our story..... relay tension! I have been having problems with my KTU as I wanted to wire in a 210 KTU into the system and the station lamp stayed on steady.... after joel explained the the FA and FB relays work together I started to tinker with the relays... and it was the tension on the FA relay.... too weak, the relay wouldnt release properly. after some tweaking, I was able to adjust the tension so now my wink cycle works like its suppose to. when the R relay it energized, the lamps blink like they are suppose to and then the cycle times out. the lights go off and the system resets... now, it this suppose to work on the hold cycle? so far no... the lights stay steady.. do the lights need to routed through a relay? maybe... though the 210 KTU, Yes. I big shout of thanks to joel and phil for all there advise! thanks guys, you are great! Merry Christmas to everyone on this BBS/Forum! John

John