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Independent Testing Uncovers Serious Fire Safety Concerns with Many Communications Cables from Offshore Manufacturers. CCCA Proposes New Certification Program. Article here. -Hal
CALIFORNIA PROPOSITION 65 WARNING: Some comments made by me are known to the State of California to cause irreversible brain damage and serious mental disorders leading to confinement.
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Moderator-Avaya
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Moderator-Avaya
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Thanks for posting the article Hal. I got a copy in a vendor's catalog a few months ago. Something everyone should read and take to heart.
Avaya SMB Authorized Business Partner. ACIS/APSS ESI Certified Reseller/Installer www.regal-comm.com
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Retired phone dude
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Moderator-Nortel, Computers, General
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Moderator-Nortel, Computers, General
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Interesting read & just in time. I got an email this w/e from one of my suppliers offering Cat5e for $50 less/box than where I buy it now.
Guess I'll call with questions tomorrow am before ordering.
Scientists say that the universe is made up of Protons, Neutron & Electrons. They forgot "Morons". Dave. (CTUB) Canadian Techs Use Bix!
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Probably the only safe avenue is to purchase brand name products from suppliers you trust. There is no way for us as installers to determine whether a cable meets specs. All we have to go by is what's printed on the jacket and a UL label and as you can see these crooks have found a way to falsify all of it.
At this point any cable that is not brand name, sold through an outfit you never heard of especially on the net or is significantly cheaper should be suspect. Dave, I doubt that any of those kind of suppliers will give you a straight answer.
-Hal
CALIFORNIA PROPOSITION 65 WARNING: Some comments made by me are known to the State of California to cause irreversible brain damage and serious mental disorders leading to confinement.
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Nine of the nine samples did not fully comply with TIA 568-B industry minimum requirements for physical and electrical performance (as specified for Category 5e/6 cables). OUCH! the electrical performance should get caught if you run a certification after installation, but how do you tell if your plenum wire is really plenum safe?
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"but how do you tell if your plenum wire is really plenum safe?" I will tell you PVC or Plenum rated cable is not safe when it's on fire. I've intentionally set pvc and plenum cable on fire just to see if there is any visual difference. Like the color of the smoke and intensity of the fire and the way it spreads. I could not tell the difference and this was Commscope brand. Been some years since I tried this however it was not a real scientific approach! I do know there is a hell of a difference in cost betweeen pvc and plenum. But I've often wondered if some of the no-name brands label pvc jacket with CMP. Besides if a building catches fire and cables are burned pvc or plenum they are going to need to be replaced! I've heard inspectors tell clients that the reason for plenum is the toxicity of the smoke coming from the cable. I always laugh and say "Who the hell is going to stay in a building with it on fire" !!!!
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Moderator-Vertical, Vodavi, 1A2, Outside Wire
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Moderator-Vertical, Vodavi, 1A2, Outside Wire
Joined: Jan 2005
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I am a firm believer that many of these shady manufacturers just print "CMP" on regular PVC cable. I'm not so sure that their compounds even qualify it as suitable for type CMR.
Yes, it is true that the low horizontal flame spread and toxicity are the major factors in the requirement for plenum-rated cable. It doesn't carry a burn well in a horizontal environment, but it goes up like a match when placed vertically. The opposite is true for riser-rated cable.
As for the toxicity issue, it is important to remember that a fire may be burning on an other floor or otherwise undetected. A fire on the first floor may produce poisonous smoke that enters the building's HVAC system and makes it to the tenth floor. That is the real concern, not a huge fire where a mass evacuation would be necessary.
Ed Vaughn, MBSWWYPBX
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Ed, I agree it's really important to use the right cable and fire penetrators as well. I see so many cables just poked through fire walls no sleeves,no conduit, no fire caulk, no nothing .And the wrong cable on top of that. Just asking for trouble. About as bad as the sheetrock guy dumping red chalk and mixing it into the drywall mud and calling it fire sealed. I once watched a video of demonstrations of how fire spreads throughout buildings that have improper fire wall penetrations. It's really a problem from all the trades combined from the plumbers to the HVAC guys. It's pretty interesting how quick a fire can spread out of one room through just a few small 1" holes.
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Good post Hal. Originally posted by clgjr: ...I've heard inspectors tell clients that the reason for plenum is the toxicity of the smoke coming from the cable. I always laugh and say "Who the hell is going to stay in a building with it on fire" !!!! I know you were tongue-in-cheek so please don't take this jib as a jab. The answer to your question is: Nobody is going to stay in the building INTENTIONALLY. But what if you get trapped by a falling beam temporarily and have to wait on fire rescue people to get you out. If you're breathing toxic fumes you're probably gonna croak! I know sometimes all of the fire codes seem a little far fetched but when it comes down to a life and death matter every little bit helps. :thumb:
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