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I need to connect 1 microphone to about 9 bogen tpu-100b amplifiers for emergency backup. They are already using the tel page & music inputs on amps , so will have to use the mic inputs, but what will i need to go 1mic output= 9 mic inputs
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They make microphone splitter boxes that the media uses its been to long of time to remember who but it may come to me later. :confused: try this
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Need some more info here.
Are 9 amps being used due to separate zones?
How are the tel page and music ports being used now, from a zone controller or just parallel wired?
If you are not dealing with zones, those Bogen amps have bridging jacks on them that can be used to parallel all the inputs. You just need to bridge them with RCA patch cords and feed one mic input.
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It is an hospital with 9 departments a seperate amplifier for each department, music inputs ar parallel wired, as well as tel page.The microphone will be about 100' away in ER
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Sounds like the original installers didn't know what they were doing.
Only the first amp should have been fed with the tel page and music inputs. All the rest should have been bridged using the jacks. I question the need for 9 amps too, but that's another topic.
A 100feet distance won't be a problem with a low impedance mic (which that amp is capable of). Run 2 conductor shielded and if you want music muting with a switch on the mic, use 4 conductor shielded (that amp has two screw terminals for mic muting).
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but how do i enter the mic output to each of 9 inputs, will i not have to much loss?
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You're not reading my posts, I thought I spelled it out pretty clearly!
You feed the mic input on one amp only (pick a master). Those amps have bridging jacks on them. You would take an RCA patch cord and jump from the main amp to the next amp to the next and so on. By doing it this way, the mic is only connected to one amp, no loss, and the bridging jacks are active (meaning they are electronically split, isolated, and maintain the level).
You should also disconnect the paralleled "tel page" and "music" inputs too. Same thing, they only need to feed one amp (the master) and the bridging jacks will carry those signals to the other amps as well. That's why I said the original installers didn't know what they were doing. If you leave them hooked up this way and patch the bridge jacks, you will get a funky feedback noise due to the delay.
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Here is something else into the mix, only 2 amplifiers play music, Entrance amp & Lobby waiting areas, but they would need to recieve page during emergency, also 2 amps are peavey's and I havent been on site to see if they have a bridged input & output. could I bridge those 2 amps together with a mic input to it, and bridge the other 7 together with a parellel mic connection to it?
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Well, that makes things a little more complicated.
The bridging jacks on the Bogen amps are two-way, meaning that if you feed an input into any amp along the chain, it will send it to the rest. This is what you want for the mic input, however not what you want for the music.
The Peavey amps will probably have line out and line in jacks on them (one-way, might be labelled pre-out and main-in). What would be ideal is if those two Peaveys are being used for the two areas that require music. If you feed the music into a channel input on the first Peavey, use a patch cord to take line out from it to line in on the second Peavey.
Bridge all the Bogens with RCA patch cords and from the last one go into a channel input on the first Peavey that you have music feeding in to (from a Bogen bridge jack, you will probably need a RCA to 1/4" cord for this).
This will allow any input on the Bogens (feed your mic and tel page into one of them) to carry throughout all the amps. The music feeds only the second last amp which is the first Peavey. This amp (line out) feeds the last Peavey (line in).
One other point, because of those Peaveys, you won't have priority paging anymore (mic cuts out the music). It's too bad they are there, not really designed for a commercial paging application.
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After sleeping on it, I thought of another way to wire this if two of the Bogens are presently being used for the music zones.
You would link those two music amps only using one RCA patch and the bridging jacks. Make sure music is only being fed into one of these amps and the new mic and tel page has to be fed into one of the other Bogens.
Bridge all the other Bogens (should be 5 of these now) and the last one would go to a channel input on the first Peavey. Line out on that Peavey goes to Line in on the 2nd.
You will now have one RCA bridge jack left on the 5 Bogens. Take that jack and feed it to a channel input on the two music Bogens (you can use the music input jack on the 2nd amp as the music source is feeding the music input on the first amp).
If the Bogen amps are close to each other, you can connect the mic switch to the mic mute terminals on the amp that has the music source connected to it. Don't use the mic input terminals on this amp however, feed the mic itself into the master Bogen of the group of 5. Now you will have music muting when paging with the mic.
If you want me to draw a diagram, confirm what amps you have there (model #'s), the location of them along with which amps are doing music, and I can draw one up for you.
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Twisted pair you da man!!!!! I am going on site today to confirm model numbers, this is a hospital that always calls us to clean up someone elses mess.
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ok it has 1 peavey ua35tii has aux input with 2 rca plugs, 1 executone wma-35 has no visible input/output can be replaced with bogen if need be,& 7 tpu 1 b in which actually only 1 is for paging & music.I really appreciate all your help...
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Okay, just to double check a few things.
I think you mean TPU-100B, I don't think there is such a thing as a TPU-1B.
You said only 1 of the Bogens are being used for music and paging but I think you mean music only, all amps are used for tel page?
I found the specs for the Peavey online but I can't find the Executone.
If anyone on here knows this amp (Executone WMA-35), please chime in here. I need to know what it has for ins and outs.
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You hit it right , my wireless keyboard battery must be low, it is missing key strokes. It is tpu-100b, yes they all have page & will all need microphone, but only 1 bogen instead of 2 has music, I told him today I thought I would have to replace the executone, because it didn't appear to have bridging jacks.
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This sounds like a real mess. Looks to me like you can replace all the amps with two, 1 for the entrance and lobby and the other for the rest. Probably the reason for all the amps is that there are a lot of speakers and the incompetent who did that didn't know about a 70 volt constant voltage system. So that will require replacing speakers also.
That's where I would begin. Trying to work with what's there is a waste of time, throwing good money after bad. Walk away if they aren't receptive to a complete replacement.
I also think you are in over your head here if you didn't recognize this.
-Hal
CALIFORNIA PROPOSITION 65 WARNING: Some comments made by me are known to the State of California to cause irreversible brain damage and serious mental disorders leading to confinement.
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no need to be rude, I appreciate twisted pair helping without making any negative comments,I did not design the system , I have just worked with the new maintenance director at other facilities,and am trying to use what they have to add an emergency microphone,speakers are tapped different in different areas and would be a pain to change to 2 amps, plus it would be a huge job to replace all the speakers, which are all ready 70v,so i don't understand what you nmean replace them. I have been a telephone man for 13 years , but i wasn't born one, haven't ran into anybody that knows everything, I would even being willing to bet that i could help you on something someday...
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I didn't mean to be rude just telling it like I see it. Not everybody is going to tell you what you want to hear. We all can't be experts at everything, you have to know your limitations.
If all speakers are 70 volt then you won't need to change them but there is no need for all those amps either. Two zones/two larger amps, power is cheap. If you can run wiring for a microphone you can run wiring to connect the speaker sections together and remove the unneeded amps.
Once you do that it will be easy to add your paging mic. to the system. That's how you justify it to your customer and at the same time clean the system up.
-Hal
CALIFORNIA PROPOSITION 65 WARNING: Some comments made by me are known to the State of California to cause irreversible brain damage and serious mental disorders leading to confinement.
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damn i love this site!! We ran into the same issues at a casino!
9yrs and still green!!
What a strange world we live in...
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I believe the system was originally zoned, was the reason for the amps???I think twisted pair is on the right page, does anybody see a problem with using the bridging jacks & existing infastructure
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Sorry, long post! We are still trying to find more info on that Executone WMA-35 amp. We believe it is probably made by Bogen but the closest I can find on the web is the WMA-80. This amp uses modules so it may not have a "line-in" module and it doesn't appear to have any bridge or line-out jacks. The Peavey is on the web and it has those two RCA jacks which are just a summed input (meaning they are resistor wye adapted to mono inside) and no line out jacks. If they were all Bogen TPU's, everything would be great, but we are dealing with a couple other brands here. Bogen has the bridge jacks which as I mentioned before, is a two way link, almost like having a line-in and line-out travelling down the same cable. Bogen doesn't recommend it, but I have seen and done it where you take the bridge jack and feed it to a line in on another amp (like the Peavey). Without going into a lot of electronic detail here, it will be a test. It may work fine, or the line in circuitry may short out the bridge jacks causing no sound to carry over. Here's your steps: Basically pick a TPU100 and feed the tel page and your new "all call" mic into it (we'll call this our master). Use the mic input on this master for your new mic. It has two screw terminals for a low impedance mic and there is a ground terminal there too (XLR on mic, pins 2 & 3 will go to the screw terminals and pin 1, the shield, will go to ground). Make sure you use a low impedance, balanced mic for this (you mentioned you have to go about 100' for it). Pick a second TPU and feed only the music into it (either use the RCA jack or the screw terminals), this will be our music zone amp. There are two screw terminals on this amp labelled "mute" and wire the switch from your new mic to these. This will mute the music on this zone when you are using the mic. Note how this is wired, the mic is actually wired to the master amp but the switch from it is wired to the music amp. Take a RCA patch cord and plug it into one of the bridge jacks on the master. Cut the other plug off, strip the wires and feed them into either tel page or mic input. The bridge jack is actually a high impedance line level and since the music amp only has one high line level jack (the music jack which you are using) you will have to feed it into a lower level jack. The tel page being 600 ohms is probably your best bet but you will have to set that level a little higher on that amp. Do not plug it into the bridge jack on that amp otherwise you will carry the music back to the master which is not what you want. Use a second RCA patch and from the other bridge jack on the master, patch it to the next TPU and so on with the remainder of the TPU's. Test everything so far to make sure you have sound. Now from the last TPU, patch the remaining bridge jack to one of those two music jacks on the Peavey. Test again to make sure this isn't shorting out the bridge jacks. The Executone will somehow have to be fed as well, but without knowing what it has for inputs, I'm not sure what to tell you. It may be possible to use a wye adapter from that last TPU and feed it to both the Peavey and the Exec, but again, it will be a test. If wiring it this way shorts out the bridging circuit, you will lose sound and have to make your own line out jacks. This can be done by wiring the following circuit: ![[Linked Image from i46.photobucket.com]](https://i46.photobucket.com/albums/f114/twistedpair/lineout.jpg)
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it doesn't appear to have line in jacks , so going to replace the peavey & executone with tpu100b amps , go into master with mic, bridge each one through, last amp in line will be music , so i will add mic mute in it, that should work the best right, now just have to get a part number from bogen or may go to their site to see which mic to order with my tpu amps. Thanks very much,Twisted pair & everybody that help
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i have got 3 new tpu-100b to replace other amplifiers, but called bogen and you can only bridge 3 of these together,please help,need device that turns 1 microphone output into 10 outputs for each of 10 amp inputs.
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You don't need a "device that turns 1 microphone output into 10 outputs for each of 10 amp inputs".
You need to fix the original problem as Hal pointed out earlier. Rewire and remove the extra amps. You probably only need 2 maybe 3 amps there (one dedicated for the music zone).
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